A through investigation has been done into the facts of Fast and Furious. Obama and Holder knew exactly what they were doing.
REMEMBER IN NOVEMBER!
A weapon tied to "Operation Fast and Furious" was seized in Tijuana in connection with a drug cartel's conspiracy to kill the police chief of Tijuana, Baja California, who later became the Juárez police chief, according to a U.S. government report.
The firearm was found Feb. 25, 2010, during an arrest of a criminal cell associated with Teodoro "El Teo" García Simental and Raydel "El Muletas" López Uriarte, allies of the Sinaloa cartel.
Tijuana police said they arrested four suspects in March 2010 in connection with a failed attempt to take out Julián Leyzaola, and that the suspects allegedly confessed to conspiring to assassinate the police chief on orders from Tijuana cartel leaders.
Here's another good link on the subject... ;)
I think the truth about Fast & Furious is that the ATF had intelligence they wanted to act on, but US attorneys refused to act on it. That is from other sources that were a little more clear and specific about their investigation into F&F than the link submitted above.
What is happening in Mexico is truly horrific. I've enjoyed a couple of vacations there, but I will not return. Even when I went I was wary of crime and corruption among the police there. I was fortunately not a victim of crime, but a friend of mine was taken to an ATM by Mexican police just so he could walk back to his hotel. He was guilty of being an American and not having enough money in his wallet.
It won't solve all of their problems, nor will it solve all of ours, but it's time to admit defeat in the war on (some) drugs. The Mexican cartels get most of their money from marijuana. That should be an issue for states to decide, not the federal government. Why did it take an amendment to the Constitution to enact alcohol prohibition but the federal government claims interstate commerce clause is enough for them to ban marijuana?
Did we learn nothing from the Volstead Act? It was doomed to fail from the start and did nothing but lead to crime and violence. We are repeating history's mistakes by keeping marijuana illegal.
I say it's time to cut off the funding of Mexican cartels. The DEA estimates that 60-70% of that funding comes from marijuana. Will the cartels simply shift into other businesses? Well, they're already doing that. The market for harder drugs is already saturated. People aren't going to start using meth or cocaine or heroin if pot is legalized. The gateway theory has been debunked and if there is a gateway to drug use, it is alcohol anyway. The cartels are already into human trafficking and they even steal petroleum from pipelines and ship it to the US.
Obama has made it clear. He won't even consider legalization. He has even gone back on his promise to not go after medical dispensaries who are complying with the laws of their own state. Republicans and Tea Partiers who believe in smaller government and state's rights and individual freedom should support this idea.
Will children get marijuana as a result? I would point out that they are getting it now. It's easier for many children in the US to get marijuana than it is for them to get alcohol.
We arrest close to a million people a year over pot, but most pot users never get caught. It's a burden on law enforcement and it's a burden on our judicial system. It's a source of lost revenue from taxation.
Does it lead to crime? Prohibition certainly leads to crime and if people do stupid things when they are stoned we already have laws against DUI and other crimes commonly associated with drugs.
Vince, you make good points on the legalization of marijuana. Regardless of how you feel on that issue, the arming of the cartels with guns and ammunition has got to be a really criminal activity that was concocted by Hillary, Obama, Napalitano, and Holder, especially considering there was no mechanism to follow the weapons.
Vince, making murder illegal leads to people being convicted of it. This is the extension of your logic. Owning a machine gun without special license in the US is illegal. Most people do not own machine guns. They wish to obey the law. Also, since other guns, sufficient to self-protection and hunting needs are available, there is no great need for private citizens to own them. So, there is no weight to any argument by pro-gun groups to legalize them.
Similarly, there is no weight to arguments to legalize marijuana. For every perceived medicinal use, there are conventional medications to serve us. At one time, I would have loved to see marijuana legalized, but I have since grown up. I would also like to own a machine gun, but I am realistic enough to admit that I don't need one. I'd probably shoot both my feet off with it, anyway!
But there's one major flaw in your counter-argument and that is that murder takes another person's life. Someone smoking marijuana harms no one but themselves just as someone having a drink has no effect on others. I'm not making the case for medical marijuana. I think the alleged benefits are overblown I'm saying it should be determined by individual states as outlined in the 10th Amendment.
Both are crimes, and that's all we need to know...
Ooops, should have posted this under this discussion instead of "The Eligibility Issue"--sorry!!!
What do you all make of this and I have to ask, why should we believe what a "criminal" is claiming and if he's been extradited to Chicago, how long before someone gets to him and he's a goner (especially for talking)?
High-Ranking Mexican Drug Cartel Member Makes Explosive Allegation: ‘Fast and Furious’ Is Not What You Think It Is
A high-ranking Mexican drug cartel operative currently in U.S. custody is making startling allegations that the failed federal gun-walking operation known as “Fast and Furious” isn’t what you think it is.
It wasn’t about tracking guns, it was about supplying them — all part of an elaborate agreement between the U.S. government and Mexico’s powerful Sinaloa Cartel to take down rival cartels.
The explosive allegations are being made by Jesus Vicente Zambada-Niebla, known as the Sinaloa Cartel’s “logistics coordinator.” He was extradited to the Chicago last year to face federal drug charges. . .
That's what I have been saying. It is not an operation that was botched. It is a conscious attempt by Holder and Obama to arm the Mexican Drug Cartel. No one believes that these bozos could be that cynical but they are and worse. What's more they murdered Judge John Roll and attempted to murder Gabby Giffords to cover up the exposure of Fast and Furious, but it came out anyway 2 weeks after the Tucson shooting. Is anyone awake?
I'd be very reluctant to believe the word of someone who likes to send messages by cutting people's heads off and leaving them in the street.
Would you believe the people who supply them with weapons that have killed hundreds or thousands of Mexicans including police officers, government officials, and at least 2 American agents?
Holder has already knowingly lied under oath.
Obama lies every time he speaks.
The ATF agents have spoken out. Seems to be an issue with US attorneys. The Mexican cartels do get some of their guns from the US, but more so than that they get them from the Mexican military and other foreign sources..
And please be careful with your facts. There are not hundreds of thousands of Mexicans dead. There is a huge number, but it is not that high.