Is the RNC lying to us?...or, what now folks?

There still seems to be some disagreement of who should be the RNC candidate for 2012. This discussion's not about the candidates!

It's about published rules. It's about ignoring said rules. It's about unequal application of rules! Also, about disenfranchisement of voters. And documents certain untruths.

Perhaps it's also about where we shall go from here....can we trust the RNC in the future to follow the will of the voters?

Let us begin:

In a Press release, April 1010 the RNC Announced the 2012 Presidential Nominating Schedule Committee rules.  In a nutshell, the published rules are as follows:

  1. The four carve-out states of Iowa, Nevada, New Hampshire, South Carolina may begin their processes any time on or after February 1, 2012.
  2. The remainder of the states may begin no earlier than the first Tuesday of March 2012. 
  3. Any state (other than the four carve-out states) that conducts its process prior to April 1, 2012, must allocate its delegates on a proportional basis.
  4. Any state that violates this Rule will lose 50% of its delegates, alternate-delegates and potentially face many other penalties.
Rule 3., Proportional Allocation was provided with no equivocation. None!
Rule 4., Loss  of 50% of delegates, provides for addition penalty possibilities.
The ad hoc  ruling in the case of Florida is an obvious suspension of the RNC's published rule 3 and is an obvious case of favoritism.
Rule 3. was also agreed to by the  convened committee  Noteworthy is that of the 7 members, Paul Senft – National Committeeman, FL was on the committee, and was cognizant of the terms set forth therein!
No subsequent modifications to these rules by the committee have been published, nor any record of said meeting has been found.

This takes us to violations in SC and N.H. as well as Fla..  RNC chairman Reince Priebus's statement @ http://caucuses.desmoinesregister.com/2011/10/25/gop-chairman-flori..."However, as a consequence, South Carolina and New Hampshire will also be stripped of half their delegates for the Republican National Convention"

These carve-out states are also defined in  2008_RULES_Adopted.pdf, an earlier document referenced later as well, below.

A misstatement by Chairman Reince Priebus?

Doubtful..clearly stated in both documents. In modern English. Not in "Legalese"

How do the present total delegate counts compare, by applying the RNC's established and standing rules? I ran a quick spreadsheet: the output lines of which follow:

Candidate Romney Newt Santorum Paul
Presently reported totals 71 23 13 3
Rules applied totals. 49 85 20 6
The above is not about candidates, really! One of them could be the Socialist Easter Bunny for all I care.(at least he redistributes to the kiddies) It's about the subversion of the voter's selections. Subversion of the rules. And reversal of the results of the of the Republican voter's choices!
Time for more untruthful statements? Try this:

We are to believe whatever the RNC tells us, eh? I've mostly been referencing the Published RNC rules for 2012: the latest publication
RNC General counsel Bill Crocker stated, in part, the following paragraph:
"With regard to proportionality, the RNC does not have the authority to intervene in a state’s primary plans beyond the imposition of the Rule 16 penalties.  A contest procedure exists for challenges to a state’s delegation or delegates.  The RNC cannot consider any issue regarding Florida’s delegation unless and until a proper contest is brought.  If a contest is properly and timely filed, the Committee on Contests and the RNC will have the opportunity to hear the contest and determine if there are any further steps to be taken beyond the penalties that have already been imposed."

The general council is referencing the 2008_RULES_Adopted.pdf, an earlier document and is choosing  selected references only.... and only one the applicable clauses of rule 16! Without referencing the clauses, either... But let's look briefly at the 2008 document...

Among the clauses misapplied would be South Carolina's halving of delegates, in defiance of 15.(b)(1)

  • (1) No primary, caucus, or
    convention to elect, select, allocate, or bind delegates to
    the national convention shall occur prior to the first
    Tuesday in March in the year in which a national
    convention is held. Except Iowa, New Hampshire,
    South Carolina, and Nevada may begin their processes
    at any time on or after February 1 in the year in which a
    national convention is held and shall not be subject to
    the provisions of paragraph (b)(2) of this rule.

The RNC council also misstated on Tuesday when he said " In addition, the RNC Rules Committee imposed every available discretionary penalty ..." Reference is made to

  • Any state (other than the four carve-out states) that conducts its process prior to April 1, 2012, must allocate its delegates on a proportional basis.
  • Note also that  "carve out states" have been injured to greater  extent than the State of Florida, disallowed by the RNC rules to occur before March 6!

Perhaps he didn't lie, since this is a mandatory  penalty that was not applied, not discretionary!

To say that the RNC lacks control....they retain the authority to not seat them, hotel location, guest privileges,VIP passes and everything, really!See 16.(e)(3) for starters.

One can find many, many direct infractions of the rules, in both publications. All I will say is that we are being lied to repeatedly in these matters. You can read or take my word for it....I've provided links,  references, quoted passages and so on.

There's a lot more...I'm just not going to waste my time or yours further at this time! This post is simply getting too long. I've edited out about half of the information

Summary:

  • The RNC is applying rules in an arbitrary manner. Rewarding some States while denying others their fair representation, in defiance of RNC's own published rules.
  • Delegate allocation to date appears to be a reversal of the actual front-runner totals, while denying   full representation to the 3rd and 4th place candidates.
  • In all States to date, the RNC's positions have been in favor of a single candidate, without regard to the desires of the citizens of these Several States. While no proof of intent exists, misstatements at the top party levels are documented above and demonstrated to be false.
  • Is it now time to discuss the formation of a party for Conservatives? While I have railed against such an idea, it appears plain the RNC wishes us only for our votes.
  • I ask that this discussion not degrade into candidate bashing! Let us focus on the Republican Party! Is the RNC representing the will of Conservatives?

What say you?

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Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Jim Delaney on February 4, 2012 at 10:30am

Well said, Rondo.

Another Vietnam Vet

Permalink Reply by Jim Pryor on February 4, 2012 at 9:58am

Our next President MUST BE principled,,and ETHICAL  !!!!!  I like Romney for those reasons.. Gingrich needs to get out of public service and/ or influence peddling  !!!

A red, white and blue American North Korean, Iron Tringle. War Veteran.

Permalink Reply by janet barks on February 4, 2012 at 12:48pm

Remember Jim,

This was not to be a topic about the candidates.

Permalink Reply by David Evans on February 4, 2012 at 10:00am

I agree completely with your analysis.  It appears that rules are to be followed only when they agree with the desired outcome.  Both the DNC and RNC are guilty of this violation of ethics.  The method used by the party establishments to chose their candidates is replete with political cronyism and money. This probably has been true to some extent for years but it has been much more pronounced in recent years.  The result has been the likes of Dole and McCain for the Republicans and Gore and Dukakis for the Democrats.

Like you, I have avoided naming actual current candidates (although I have my strong preference).  The problem is one of ethical leadership and the removal of obvious favoritism.

Hopefully the voting public (other than those who wish to maintain and enlarge an 'entitlement state') are becoming more aware of the devious leadership of the RNC.  We conservatives are at present aligned with the Republican Party.  However we must work harder to define conservatism and be much more vocal with our principles.  If the RNC refuses to acknowledge our voice and exercise ethics then we must become the masters of our own destiny.

Permalink Reply by Karl Schill on February 4, 2012 at 10:01am

I'm sick of hearing about Conservative's this and Concervative's that, in 2008 most so called Conservatives staid home and did not support the Republican candidate and look what we got. If this is what they are going to do this year, guess what four more years of Barry and the end of this Republic. If this is what you want then shut up and keep yor narrow minded reason's for not voting for a moderate because this is what the Independents want and you cant win without them.

Permalink Reply by Vern Shotwell on February 4, 2012 at 10:21am

Sorry Karl. This is why I reiterated several times that I wish this discussion to focus on the process, rather than the candidates. But I did make references to Conservatives...I am properly chastened. Thank you.

Permalink Reply by Thomas Carroll on February 4, 2012 at 7:36pm

Ok, I've got a question for you.  Why do we always have to pander to the left?  Why can't we stay on message so the moderate & independent voter understand get the message between food stamps V. Pay checks

Dependence V. Independence & so forth.  You sound very much like someone I used to respect...hhhmmm...what was her name?...Oh?...Was it Ann Coulter?  I don't know her anymore.  Neither do I know who Niki Haley or Christy are.

Permalink Reply by Tim Sheflin on February 4, 2012 at 10:05am

Thank You, Vern. You have put well into words what I have been trying to convey for years. We cannot do anything about the recent four primaries, the RNC is intent on doing what they want. Our goal is from here on. We must attempt to influence the voters in the rest of the states to vote for anyone other than Romney. In Virginia, I am convincing people to vote for Ron Paul because, as you know, there is only Paul and Romney on the ballot. If we can influence it enough to arrive at an Open Convention, I fell we may have a chance to finally put the RNC back in it's place.

Permalink Reply by Chas Jones on February 4, 2012 at 10:08am

Let us prioritize while also proving we may "walk and chew gum at the same time."

1) Let's contribute our time, money, intelligence and passion to nominating conservatives for President, House and Senate, and all State and local offices during this 2012 election cycle

2) Regardless of outcomes, IF the RNC tries to manipulate, lie, or cheat the voters then let us research the "nuts and bolt" requirements for either joining an existing 3rd Party or forming one.

3) Obtain a domain name where folks may register with some solid method of verification, said web site to serve to coordinate and inform as the new Party forms and grows

All the while Pray and Hope that the RNC wises up and obeys Rules and Stands for fundamental unalienable Rights, our Founding Documents, and the Rule of valid and constitutional Law.

2012 should be the RNC's Final opportunity to return to the principles upon which this republic and the GOP were formed.

These are my thoughts on this extremely grave matter. Let us decide wisely based upon facts, transparency, and Truth!

Permalink Reply by Norma J. Sears on February 4, 2012 at 10:10am

Chas, Only problem I see with your post is HOPE.  We've done that for years.  How's that worked out for us?

Vern,  We start by telling the RNC, State leaders that we know what is going on and to stop it.  They're so used to doing what they want because we had blinders on for years.  Thanks to our own awakening and people like you lifting up the carpet so we can see the real dirt.

I've had it with "so-called" republicans and I let them know every chance I get.

Permalink Reply by janet barks on February 4, 2012 at 12:52pm

So, then you agree that we should all write a letter to let the RNC know that we are against their shenanigans.

Permalink Reply by SHARRON AMSTER on February 4, 2012 at 10:12am

What do we do? We write in the man of our choose. I don't care what they want. We have our man and I say we start backing the one it will be so all will know and will pen him or her in. The time has come. Lets show them what real Americans look like when you mess with us.  GOD BLESS

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